e pluribus unum

Jul 10, 2008 at 9:55 PM
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A report made by the Bradley Project indicates America is losing its national identity and makes a series of suggestions.

Guess what? Conservatives have been saying this for decades. This is one of the biggest problems we have with illegal immigration from our neighbor and the literal danger multiculturalism presents whether its Islamism, black pride, or the hispanic influx of self identifying Mexicans who move here and buy houses, own and run businesses but still refer to Mexico as home. The degrees and doctorates have had their common sense educated out of their egg heads.

National Unity study report

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As the world globalizes and moves closer and closer to full multiculturalism, it is necessary to abandon nationalism and other ideologies, religion and other dogmas, otherwise they'll cause undue stress and conflict. Nobody needs to see Helter Skelter in action just because white racists and black racists can't get over their divisive politics. National identity isn't as important as individual identity or community identity or human identity. There are other countries with multiculturalism as strong as the US and a weaker national identity [Canada comes to mind] and yet there is still a national identity, it just isn't primary in everyone's mind and really doesn't need to be.

This is good. Listen, I don't know what they teach in the public schools in any subject, quite frankly. I will say I know bleeding heart Liberals who staunchly believe that if you become an American, SPEAK ENGLISH for God's sake. And embrace our history. It seems the end message said corporatism, government corruption contributed as well as the immigrant "privilege" to trump their origin over their US citizenship or US residency. The recommendations did not say abandon your heritage, they said embrace it AND be American. I wholeheartedly agree. But I also know many naturalized citizens know far more American history then 5th generation American high school kids.

That's where our taxes go. I have always thought that if you have a parent who speaks a second language you should take advantage and learn it. It only makes the child more "marketable" in the future in employment because of globalization.
So I love this post.
I sat at a party with a mixed group of ultra conservative and ultra liberal and it's funny, but that was a topic of conversation - everyone's frustration: you want to live in this country? Become American. LEARN ENGLISH.

But I don't think that means anyone has to give up pride of heritage. I'm proud of all the different nationalities that are a part of me. But when all is said and done, I am an American. I also think the loss of identity is the fractionalization caused by ideological differences and the need "win." I just wish liberals and conservatives, democrats and republicans and different faiths and races and would just work together for the greater good. For the GREATER GOOD. All of these are more identities that dilute a United America. Remember 9/11? Then it was United We Stand. If people could only remember that and work together toward solutions.
I know. Pollyanna.

Black Liberation Theology is not pride of heritage. Neither is referring to an immigrant's motherland as home. My complaint here is separatism. I have no complaint with pride of heritage. I have all manner of complaint with foreign identity in the pursuit of multi-cutluralism. What makes us American is the identity with an ideal, not a religion, not a race or culture, and especially not station. That ideal is radical personal freedom. The opportunity to choose your own life. Not a guarator of success or happiness, but a guarantor of its pursuit.

I already said we need to abandon ideology and dogmas. Referring to the motherland as home is more prideful of one's heritage than saying America is one's home. Forgive me if I do not take it seriously when Mexican immigrants identify with Mexico as their home. I remember that Italian, Irish, Scottish, German and Ukrainian immigrants of the past regarded Italy, Ireland, Scotland, Germany and Ukraine as their home. It's not a new attitude and it's not a dangerous attitude, or every immigrant society would have fallen to pieces by now. There is no reason one cannot identify with the ideals of the country they move to as well as the connection with the country they have left.

The immigrants I'm referring to were waiving Mexican flags and claiming California belonged to Mexico in a protest march here in Southern Californa. Banking institutions are proffering loans to illegal immigrants to buy homes and start businesses. Something wrong with this picture. Why did they leave Mexico if Mexico is a better culture and government? These are people who do not identify with the American ideal.

[this is good]

I like that.

That ideal is radical personal freedom. The opportunity to choose your own life. Not a guarantor of success or happiness, but a guarantor of its pursuit.

Apparently you've never met an immigrant before. They all prefer home, because home is where they grew up and their greatest identity is going to be the one fostered since their youth. I have known Greek, Bosnian, Serbian [those two were fun to get together, cripes], Russian immigrants and more, and they always think of their homeland as their home, and they always complain about their new home. My great-grandparents bitched and moaned that the old country [Scotland] was better, and yet their children grew up without that affection. Your family came off the boat at one point, I'm sure THEY complained that they missed the old country too. Nostalgia is powerful, and the present will always seem less glorious than the past. That doesn't mean that immigrants cannot appreciate their adopted home, it does not mean that they do not love it. It just means that they still love the old country, and there's nothing wrong with that.

Something that nobody likes to bring up is that multiculturalism is effectively assimilation. When you let people come and set up their ethnic community and maintain their old traditions while obeying the new law, you create a situation where their children will grow up with strong hyphenated identities [chinese-American, Indian-American etc]. The children and grandchildren of immigrants identify more and more with the culture of the adopted home and the ancestral home, and augment both traditions. Multiculturalism doesn't result in some kind of insulated quilt of communities that never make contact with each other, it's just passive assimilation: the government doesn't declare open hostilities on other cultures, it just lets them adapt to the common one.

Your assumptions are both wrong and unappreciated. You are accusing me of bigotted ignorance. I have worked side by side with immigrants both legal and illegal all my working life. A fifty year old Ukranian I know dreamed of moving to America for half his life. He bitches and moans about the conspiracies in American seats of power constantly. He assumes all governments are as corrupt as the one he grew up in. But he knows America offers him better opportunities and he is not separating himself from American culture.

Meanwhile, most of the Mexicans are here for the paycheck and every chance they get they are off to Oaxaca to visit the family. I don't mean uncle Juan, I mean their own kids. One guy has bought a house here and still sends every spare dollar to Mexico. He is renting out the house to his teammates room by room, bunk by bunk. Multi culturalism is not assimilation. It is separatism. It is first identifying themselves as their culture and second identifying with the ideal of Amerca. The afore mentioned radical freedom. Whereas the assimilated immigrant will first identify himself as an American and then his culture and usually does so with great pride. My people got off the boat a long time ago. I recognize my culture of heritage but I am American first. Ok, so I've grown up here, so what. I have considered living elsewhere in the world. As a Democrat in the mid to late 70's, I was afraid of being drafted. There is no place I prefer to be than right here. Not because of wheather patterns or socio economic status but because this is the place that is designed to offer me the most freedom. That is rapidly changing with nanny state laws. Just ask my Ukranian friend. Even so, we still choose our status and pursuits with much more freedom than any other country offers.

If people are just living and working in America, and keeping their kids at home, then what's the problem? How can this damage the national identity any worse than Polish workers going to Britain to do the same thing, or Indian workers going to the UAE to do the same thing? They don't participate in anything but the economy, and they aren't raising their kids in America to think of Mexico as home. They're just foreign labourers, why should they think of the US as home?

"Ok, so I've grown up here, so what."
That's kind of the basis of what I'm saying. People usually identify most strongly with the culture they were raised in. Your ancestors and mine, and Mexican immigrants [with their families in tow] and Ukrainians and other immigrants are most familiar with and comfortable with their place of origin. Maybe your ancestors moved from Germany to France, and they preferred Germany, but their kids grew up as French. Then they came over to America, and they preferred France, but their kids grew up American. It's not always the case, but it's to be expected and it's common sense. Kids that grow up in culture X will identify first with culture X, that will be the first cultural identity they have. Kids born to first-generation Mexican immigrants will grow up in a Mexican-American culture, and will identify with that. Someone's values are determined by their environment; yours, for example, are very American, whereas a Mexican or Polish or Balkan or Ukrainian will share different values.

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